Joe Kort: Welcome to Smart sex-Smart Love. I'm Dr. Joe Kort and today we're going to be talking to two experts in the BDSM field. Their names are Doug and Joe. Not their real names of course. They're organizers of Oakland and Macomb rope as well as m-i-r-o-p-e-s.com. As two of the founders of the Michigan Rope Expo, they've been sharing their passion and rope adventure as kink organizers for the last six years. As rope students, they are best described as rope anarchists who prefer to break down rope to its fundamentals, and then build back up into the different passions from patterns such as goat, to predicaments to how to incorporate rope into sex and bedroom bondage. They have also presented on other topics including polyamory on behalf of the Michigan Board of Education and BDSM education alongside The Center for Relationship and Sexual Health in Royal Oak. In addition to presenting on rope, Joe is a licensed massage therapist and teaches on the healing power of touch, and both t